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Hayman

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Your comments are insensitive and not called for! Lots of people suffer from mental illness; myself included! It comes in all shapes and sizes, and your view is very out dated. I hope for your sake you mental health doesn't take a dive, because from your comments, your not very likeable and therefore people will not want to be there for you!
Today the term “mental illness” has been spread to include umpteen non-typical habits that used to be looked on as eccentricities. And the word “illness” suggests a temporary state (I had various childhood "illnesses", and as an adult was once “ill” with hepatitis), in contrast with, say, the mental condition Down’s Syndrome; a friend whom I have known for some 40 years has Down’s Syndrome.

As for the claim that “Hoarding is a mental illness”, I now have a new combi boiler that replaces the previous one that began leaking. The boiler itself was given, unused, to a neighbour. He had kept or “hoarded” it. But the boiler was too small for his house so, in turn, he gave it to me – many months ago now. Did I then “hoard” it? All the fittings and copper tube needed to connect up this boiler are decades old, having been “hoarded” for the day when they might be needed. The boxing to cover in the new pipe work came from recovered materials stored until they might be needed. The screws, likewise, came from a stock of screws and nails discarded by tradesmen when they could not be bothered to pick them up at the end of a day’s work. The result is a working boiler that required only the purchase of two small butane/propane gas bottles for soldering the copper elbows and tube. Yet “hoarding is a mental illness”?

I have daily diaries that go back to when I was 16. From them I have written and had published articles on many topics, from my time in the army to my travels and work around the world. Are those diaries a sign of “hoarding”?

A national television station is about to show some of the cine film I shot in the 1950s and 1960s. That is only possible because I have “hoarded” the footage for over 60 years. It is now of interest and value to transport and military archivists.

Since some comments have been directed at me personally, my own “experience of isolation” dates from between the ages of 5 to 13, when I was a boarding school pupil; isolation from my family. Perhaps the worst form of isolation is feeling isolated when in enforced company. The only times I have come into contact with goats have been when I have drunk their milk; first as a child in Devon, when a family friend kept some; secondly in Africa, when I bought it – fresh and still warm – from their herd boys in the mountains of Lesotho.

Throughout most of my life, I have felt alone, isolated. I do not call that “mental illness”; it is just how I am. As for my own “mental health”, I first considered killing myself when I was 25. And have thought of doing so many times since. It may still happen, especially if I find life no longer bearable; for whatever reason. My “outdated view” is the result of my personal experiences over the past eight decades.

I consider it a somewhat selfish attitude to expect anyone to “want to be there” for me. If someone wants to, it is his or her choice, just as it is my choice if I “want to be there” for someone else. And I have been. Four decades ago a work mate (female) told me, “I am not here to live up to your expectations; and you are not here to live up to mine”. A worthwhile thought for anyone posting here.
 

Sarah Waldock

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Hoarding is not really a good term for those people who collect animals. Hoarding is about keeping things which 'might come in useful' or which 'could be mended when I have time.' My mother, through her wartime childhood, had something of a hoarding problem, something I am still trying to cope with, sorting out as I have an illness, or perhaps to please Hayman it should be called a condition being chronic in nature with physical and mental aspects, which means I don't have the energy someone healthy of my age should have. Fine, this it life, it's my problem.
The collecting of animals begins with compassion and in the case of those people who have the mental quirk which does not know when to stop - and this is what makes it a mental illness, an inability to accept a limit - more animals are taken in than can be reasonably cared for. Which depends from person to person, depending on their limits. Hayman, mate, your boiler doesn't need feeding several times a day and it doesn't shit for England. Any more than my mother's unopened packets of clothing or bolts of cloth do.
 

Sarah Waldock

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Might I point out that it is undertaking any activity to excess which constitutes a mental illness, when you don't know how to stop - be that rescuing cats, smoking, drinking, gambling, collecting pokemon cards, taking risks to prove you still can, etc etc. None of those activities in themselves constitutes mental illness [with the possible exception of collecting pokemon cards] but taken past limits which cannot be reversed is.
 

Natbynature94

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Hoarding is not really a good term for those people who collect animals. Hoarding is about keeping things which 'might come in useful' or which 'could be mended when I have time.' My mother, through her wartime childhood, had something of a hoarding problem, something I am still trying to cope with, sorting out as I have an illness, or perhaps to please Hayman it should be called a condition being chronic in nature with physical and mental aspects, which means I don't have the energy someone healthy of my age should have. Fine, this it life, it's my problem.
The collecting of animals begins with compassion and in the case of those people who have the mental quirk which does not know when to stop - and this is what makes it a mental illness, an inability to accept a limit - more animals are taken in than can be reasonably cared for. Which depends from person to person, depending on their limits. Hayman, mate, your boiler doesn't need feeding several times a day and it doesn't shit for England. Any more than my mother's unopened packets of clothing or bolts of cloth do.
I never said specifically that she was hoarding animals. The full house is filled floor to ceiling of items. But great description!
 

BikinGlynn

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Might I point out that it is undertaking any activity to excess which constitutes a mental illness, when you don't know how to stop - be that rescuing cats, smoking, drinking, gambling, collecting pokemon cards, taking risks to prove you still can, etc etc. None of those activities in themselves constitutes mental illness [with the possible exception of collecting pokemon cards] but taken past limits which cannot be reversed is.
Iv definitely got an exploring mental illness then.
 

Sarah Waldock

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Iv definitely got an exploring mental illness then.
I suspect you have a passion rather than taking it to obsession. If it was a mental illness you would be on edge, jittery, unable to settle to anything on any day you could not explore. You would take any opportunity to explore without taking proper precautions. You would probably go into increasingly dangerous places because you felt driven to do to, without any care for the consequences. If this applies, then, seriously, you need help. But I think you are saying this lightly. Trust me on this, I've worked with the mentally ill. [occupational therapy only, I admit, but you still pick up a lot.]
 

Hayman

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Hoarding is not really a good term for those people who collect animals. Hoarding is about keeping things which 'might come in useful' or which 'could be mended when I have time.' My mother, through her wartime childhood, had something of a hoarding problem, something I am still trying to cope with, sorting out as I have an illness, or perhaps to please Hayman it should be called a condition being chronic in nature with physical and mental aspects, which means I don't have the energy someone healthy of my age should have. Fine, this it life, it's my problem.
The collecting of animals begins with compassion and in the case of those people who have the mental quirk which does not know when to stop - and this is what makes it a mental illness, an inability to accept a limit - more animals are taken in than can be reasonably cared for. Which depends from person to person, depending on their limits. Hayman, mate, your boiler doesn't need feeding several times a day and it doesn't shit for England. Any more than my mother's unopened packets of clothing or bolts of cloth do.
I agree that people who take on the care of unwanted or just stray animals are not “hoarding” them. But they may fail to recognise when what they are doing is not in the animals’ best interests; it’s just to satisfy their own ‘needs’. That was certainly the case with this person. As with humans, all animals deserve to live reasonable lives, but they all die in the end. Whether it is an individual or a national organisation looking after strays, etc – there is a limit to the numbers that can be kept alive and in good condition. And there are very different attitudes shown by humans depending on the species of animal in question. Rats get killed in untold numbers.

Perhaps – having been born in 1941 – I have something of your mother’s “hoarding problem”. “Make do and mend” was very much part of my childhood. I have no objection to buying new when (to me) it makes sense; I bought a new Apple laptop and a new Canon 5D – because they do the jobs I got them for. But I have never bought a new car, nor one as a status symbol; my present one is 14 years old, previous ones I kept for 10 years or more, until they needed replacing. There is the story of the person who kept used string stored by its length; one category was “string to short for anything”.

Indeed my boiler does not need feeding, but its effluents require taking care of safely. For some reason, I get a great deal of pleasure in re-using old things. Perhaps because I am saving money on buying new, but perhaps because I have worked on engineering projects where I have seen what mankind does to the planet to extract its minerals and to create other resources – for commercial purposes, or simply to enable increases in the number of humans able to live where they otherwise would not have.

Having worked with animals (horses and mules) and known farmers whose livelihoods depended on managing their herds effectively – as well as having had family cats and dogs – I have seen compassion in many forms. It does not always mean keeping an animal alive.
 

Sarah Waldock

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I agree that people who take on the care of unwanted or just stray animals are not “hoarding” them. But they may fail to recognise when what they are doing is not in the animals’ best interests; it’s just to satisfy their own ‘needs’. That was certainly the case with this person. As with humans, all animals deserve to live reasonable lives, but they all die in the end. Whether it is an individual or a national organisation looking after strays, etc – there is a limit to the numbers that can be kept alive and in good condition. And there are very different attitudes shown by humans depending on the species of animal in question. Rats get killed in untold numbers.

Perhaps – having been born in 1941 – I have something of your mother’s “hoarding problem”. “Make do and mend” was very much part of my childhood. I have no objection to buying new when (to me) it makes sense; I bought a new Apple laptop and a new Canon 5D – because they do the jobs I got them for. But I have never bought a new car, nor one as a status symbol; my present one is 14 years old, previous ones I kept for 10 years or more, until they needed replacing. There is the story of the person who kept used string stored by its length; one category was “string to short for anything”.

Indeed my boiler does not need feeding, but its effluents require taking care of safely. For some reason, I get a great deal of pleasure in re-using old things. Perhaps because I am saving money on buying new, but perhaps because I have worked on engineering projects where I have seen what mankind does to the planet to extract its minerals and to create other resources – for commercial purposes, or simply to enable increases in the number of humans able to live where they otherwise would not have.

Having worked with animals (horses and mules) and known farmers whose livelihoods depended on managing their herds effectively – as well as having had family cats and dogs – I have seen compassion in many forms. It does not always mean keeping an animal alive.
quite right; and sometimes the gift of a peaceful death is the last, best gift that can be given to an animal. Those of us who are animal owners have a responsibility towards them which is where hoarders break down. They want to do their best but fail signally, which is in its way a form of abuse.

I do make do and mend; I was brought up to it. what saddened me with my mother's things were things bought new and put away 'for when they were needed' whilst she wore clothes which were really ready to be retired. I know how to sides-to-middle sheets, and I'm happy to take a piece of broken furniture, strip it down, replace broken parts and redo the finish. There's nothing wrong in this, indeed, I think your ability to mend a boiler is a virtue in this day and age of throwing things away too readily. My washing machine is 17 years old, has been repaired twice, and does the job I want it to do without any computer to call me Dave and tell me it's afraid it can't do this. It's a lovely economic little machine. I don't have the expertise to fix it but I know a man who does.
 

john1975

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Most if not all of the abuses heaped upon poor animals are perpetrated by those that call themselves "animal lovers" Indeed, they would not have the things if they were not attracted to them.

It is a combination of things;

1, Hoarding, pure and simple.

2, To use a modern term' "virtue signalling" [Look at me look at me, i care for animals]

3, Mental illness. Is it any surprise that the majority of these morons are middle aged misfits with no friends nor children.

4, Selfishness. I have seen hundreds of horses that should have been put to sleep YEARS ago, but the owners will not, as "i love my horse" Yes, it looks like..

5, I have seen cases where, when a vet had to put a horse to sleep, the idiot owner would then be basically screaming and wailing [and thereby upsetting the poor horse in its last minutes] and friends of the owner or just people that happened to be there have had to take over.. Spineless selfish muppets that cannot control themselves should be banned from looking after anything..

john..
 

Sarah Waldock

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Most if not all of the abuses heaped upon poor animals are perpetrated by those that call themselves "animal lovers" Indeed, they would not have the things if they were not attracted to them.

It is a combination of things;

1, Hoarding, pure and simple.

2, To use a modern term' "virtue signalling" [Look at me look at me, i care for animals]

3, Mental illness. Is it any surprise that the majority of these morons are middle aged misfits with no friends nor children.

4, Selfishness. I have seen hundreds of horses that should have been put to sleep YEARS ago, but the owners will not, as "i love my horse" Yes, it looks like..

5, I have seen cases where, when a vet had to put a horse to sleep, the idiot owner would then be basically screaming and wailing [and thereby upsetting the poor horse in its last minutes] and friends of the owner or just people that happened to be there have had to take over.. Spineless selfish muppets that cannot control themselves should be banned from looking after anything..

john..
Point 3 is close to reportable. It is caused by mental illness. the rest of that sentence is uncalled for, unnecessary and derogatory. Mental illness is still illness. As much as if the sufferer was rendered unable to care properly for their animals by being put in a wheelchair by accident, or contracting polio
 

Hayman

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Point 3 is close to reportable. It is caused by mental illness. the rest of that sentence is uncalled for, unnecessary and derogatory. Mental illness is still illness. As much as if the sufferer was rendered unable to care properly for their animals by being put in a wheelchair by accident, or contracting polio
I think it wrong to say someone who collects/buys/is given/accepts far more animals than he or she can look after humanely is suffering from a "mental illness". "illness" suggests a condition that can be cured or at least treated. And John1975's use of "moron" brings up a specific mental state: "a person having an intelligence quotient of between 50 and 70, able to work under supervision". This woman was certainly obsessed about cats. It was the outcome rather than the obesssion that brought her to light. Could it not be said that Tiger Woods is/was obsessed about golf, Andy Murray about tennis? As for people who scramble around derelict places . . .
 

Sarah Waldock

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I think it wrong to say someone who collects/buys/is given/accepts far more animals than he or she can look after humanely is suffering from a "mental illness". "illness" suggests a condition that can be cured or at least treated. And John1975's use of "moron" brings up a specific mental state: "a person having an intelligence quotient of between 50 and 70, able to work under supervision". This woman was certainly obsessed about cats. It was the outcome rather than the obesssion that brought her to light. Could it not be said that Tiger Woods is/was obsessed about golf, Andy Murray about tennis? As for people who scramble around derelict places . . .
And hoarding mentality is treatable.
 

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